Feedburner URL redirection

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1/25/2011 7:56:51 AM
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Re: Feedburner URL redirection

Hi Thomas,

I want to thank you again for pushing me on this issue. That setting in Feedburner was exactly what I was looking for but I did not look carefully enough the first time and reading your blog post made me see it. In my defense I was looking for an input where the redirected from url would go but they had it hidden until you click a link to reveal it which made it difficult to spot that setting.

In any case I have implemented the redirect this morning and even updated this site with the latest code and so the blog on this site is using the redirect for the feed. This is also very timely because we will be making a new release of mojoPortal in the next few days and this improvement will be included. In the new implementation you don't have to setup any redirection yourself, if you enter the feedburner url in the settings that will be the default behavior and there is no need for a front door and back door feed because I was able to find the feedburner user agent string by looking in my IIS logs, so it does not redirect if the request is coming from the feedburner crawler, but does redirect all other requests.

One question I have for you about your wish list in your blog post, you mention wanting a setting to not add the auto discovery link in the head of the page. Since the new implementation adds the original blog feed url there not the feedburner url, do you still wish for that and if so why?

Thanks,

Joe

1/25/2011 9:32:24 AM
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Re: Feedburner URL redirection

Note, I have just updated the documentation for the new redirect logic

http://www.mojoportal.com/using-feedburner-with-your-blog.aspx

but keep in mind this is not in the current 2.3.5.8 release but will be in the 2.3.6.1 release coming in the next few days and it is also already in the source code repository.

Even though the current version links directly to feedburner, you could still go ahead and add the original blog url as the redirect url so that users will subscribe to your original blog url going forward, but the original url won't redirect until after upgrading to version 2.3.6.1

Best,

Joe

1/25/2011 9:42:09 AM
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Re: Feedburner URL redirection

Thomas,

I will add a setting also in the blog to disable the creation of the autodiscovery link for the feed. I just realized why this is useful, if you want to hard code the discovery link in layout.master so it is on every page not just the blog then we need a way to disable it from the blog so it does not get duplicated.

Best,

Joe

1/25/2011 9:49:22 AM
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Re: Feedburner URL redirection

Hi Joe,

Wow, that's very gratifying to hear your interest again.  I guess to call it interest isn't doing it justice, I can't believe you've actually implemented something so quickly.  I'm always amazed at how quickly mojoPortal gets improved to take advantage of what's going on with the web.  That's blazing fast.

Again, sorry if I sounded like a jerk at all, my only interest is making it work for my needs and trying to give that back in any way possible.  As you can see from how long the blog post was, it was definitely more involved than I thought, so I'm not surprised a brief exchange didn't give enough of the detail to see the story.  Much of my understanding changed the deeper I got, and your assessment was certainly informed, just missing an important detail as you note. I'm glad if my investigation contributes anything you and other users find useful.

As far as your notes go, that sounds on the spot by way of implementation.  The client exception makes configuration easier and that's a good thing.

For the auto-detection disabling, unfortunately, yes it's still an issue even when the link url is the correct local one.  It's because of a combination of two behaviors: first, when the user clicks the auto-detect button, the redirect is processed and shown in the addressbar as the feedburner url.  This wouldn't be so bad if the Feedburner landing page were shown, where the correct subscription buttons and the custom message were shown, but the second behavior is that IE 8 and Firefox 3 show instead their own subscription page, which strips those features.  If you subscribe at that point, you will get the Feedburner url.  There's no way to get the original url at that point.

Unfortunately, I can see no way to avoid it when using auto-detection.  It is guaranteed the user will end up with the Feedburner url using that mechanism.  It's interesting to note that it's only an issue with the auto-detect feature.  If you visit the same url directly in the browser, it properly shows the Feedburner landing page.  So it's only auto-detect that I'm concerned about.

In the case where a user isn't using Feedburner, or were using it in the non-redirected model, I'd certainly say that auto-detection is a valuable feature, so I'd just make it optional whether to use it in the redirected model.

I'll be updating my blog post to reflect the new situation.

Thanks!

Ted

1/25/2011 9:53:10 AM
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Re: Feedburner URL redirection

Thanks Ted and Joe for working your way through this. I was intrigued by Feedburner, but as Ted said in his original post, I also didn't necessarily want to commit to it 100% without using it for awhile. To me it's really a pain when feeds I subscribe to suddenly stop working, so I wanted to avoid that for our subscribers. Now we'll be able to turn on Feedburner with the option to go back to serving the feeds internally, and not kill any subscriptions. Great job all!

Jamie

1/25/2011 10:05:03 AM
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Re: Feedburner URL redirection

Hi Thomas,

You did not sound like a jerk at all and I really appreciate the effort you went to to see all the complexities and help me see them as well.

The things you just mentioned about the problems with the auto discovery issues in various browsers was also unknown to me. It is a shame it works that way because those autodiscovery links are otherwise very useful. At least we will have a choice to disable those links but I wish there was a better solution like if there were some way to detect if the request is using the discovery link and not redirect. I can think of one solution that is not perfect but might be better than nothing.

If we had some application level variable that changes each time the application starts like a random guid, we could append that guid to the discovery url as a query string param then not redirect if it matches the current version of that variable so that the user subscribes to the local blog url with the application param as part of the querystring, but then next time the app recycles (which typically happens at least once per day) the param would no longer be valid so it would then redirect to feedburner for any future requests for that url, so only on that first day would the subscriber be seeing the un-redirected url.

What do you think? worth the effort to try this?

Best,

Joe

1/25/2011 11:55:36 AM
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Re: Feedburner URL redirection

fyi, I implemented this solution with the temporary redirect bypass parameter, so now the auto discovery feed url uses the original feed url but it does not redirect until the bypass parameter changes which happens whenever the application start event fires.

I've updated this site so you can see how it works.

Best,

Joe

1/25/2011 2:19:06 PM
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Re: Feedburner URL redirection

So if I'm getting this right, you're using a rotating value on the blog url that changes every time the application is restarted.  If the request comes in with the "live" value, the request is not redirected.  Any other value is redirected, though?  Very clever.

It may be a while before the application is restarted however.  Months in my case.  It would be best if the turnaround didn't rely on an unpredictable event.  Could it issue a new value each day?

Sorry, I didn't notice you said it typically cycles once a day.  Is that a guarantee or somehow configurable?  If so I think it's a winner.

Two other thoughts:

It's still useful to be able to direct the user to a bare feed link (no value attached), especially since the value is dynamic.  In this case, I would want the redirect to be in effect so their reader subscription makes it to feedburner.  So the only time the redirect wouldn't be in effect is if they supplied the ?r= parameter but the value didn't match the live one.  [edit: sorry, I momentarily had it backwards there.  Disregard that last statement, your design already should do the right thing.]

Second, I'm curious what effect the keepalive feature has on the application recycling you mentioned.  I'm using the feature here.  Would that prevent the restart?

1/25/2011 2:35:08 PM
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Re: Feedburner URL redirection

It is configurable on the application pool, but typically it will restart at least once a day by default settings and more commonly it will happen more frequently than once a day in shared hosting. There are a number of things that can trigger the app pool recycling by configuration, it can be based on times of day, a specific number of requests or hitting a threshold of memory usage. I think it would be a very uncommon installation that would not recycle at least once per day. You can keep an eye in your mojoportal log it logs application start and end events. I think this will be sufficient and this is easy to implement compared to any other solution I can think of for making it change periodically, but other solutions are possible so if over time we get feedback that it is not sufficient we can revisit it. In general keeping an app healthy it is good to recycle at least once a day as that clears the cache and frees up memory. The machine may have months of uptime but that is a different thing.

The only downside I can think of is a rare timing of events where the page may be rendered in the browser and then the app pool recycles and then the user clicks the discovery link it would redirect, so the very worst that could happen is a few users over time subscribing directly to the feedburner url, but this should get the vast majority of users subscribed to the local feed url and then make it redirect after the variable expires.

Best,

Joe

1/25/2011 2:39:15 PM
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Re: Feedburner URL redirection

About the app keep alive it will not likely prevent recycling the app once per day, it will just keep the app form recycling due to no traffic which also happens by default IIS settings, after 20 minutes of no traffic by default it will shut the app down until a new request comes in.

But even with traffic coming in it should recycle at least once per day and possibly/probably more often.

Best,

Joe

1/25/2011 2:41:35 PM
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Re: Feedburner URL redirection

Sounds like a winner to me.

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